Making Factory Ammo Mo Deadly

[918v]

I have successfully improved Federal's American Eagle 9mm 115gr FMJ round by pulling the bullet, reducing the powder charge by one grain, and reseating the same bullet .015" deeper than it was.

This effort cut the groups in half as far as my gun goes, and now I have the means to make some very inexpensive "match" ammo. Additionally, I can lie to others about the accuracy potential of the American Eagle line.

For the exceedingly frugal, that spare grain of powder may be salvaged and used to assemble other rounds. For every four, you'll have one free powder charge.

On a side note, this stuff functions 100% and beats-up the gun less. It shoots 1" to the right of POA at 15 yards, something I can adjust out.

Now, some of you may think, "Why is 918v taking apart FC ammunition? Why not just shoot it and save the brass?"

I say, "I dunno. I wanted something to do and did it."

[Bush Pilot]

Good to see you here 918, you still doing the pizza thing?

[918v]

I never did the pizza thing. I used to work at 7-11, though.

[MakeMineaP99]

You're shooting those out of a SIG 210 and reworking factory ammo. Turn in your CRB card.

[918v]

Ok, OK... Don't kill me yet.

I also developed a nice pleasant 147gr XTP load using 3.3 grains of Bullseye, FC case and FC primer. It makes a 22LR feel vicious.

[MakeMineaP99]

Ok, OK... Don't kill me yet.

I also developed a nice pleasant 147gr XTP load using 3.3 grains of Bullseye, FC case and FC primer. It makes a 22LR feel vicious.

Have you tried that in any other pistol besides the 210? Any cycling issues?

[918v]

No.

I had to sell all my 9mm's to fund this one :(

But I really, really like it!

I figure it should function just fine as most 9's are undersprung anyway.

[Clark]

Ralph,
Alternatively, for amusement,
Take a chuck off a lathe or drill.
Put a 23/64 drill in the chuck.
Put some light oil on the tip of the drill.
Take the barrel out of the 9mm pistol.
Give the throat a few quick twists of the wrist until 158 gr XPT bullets seated out to 1.169" will drop in and drop out of the chamber.
Load 11 gr Power Pistol in RP primed brass.
Lee factory crimp so it will fall in and fall out of the chamber. [If not free it will blow the primer at 8 gr and you are going for 11]
Scribe a line on a case in the chamber to outline the feed ramp.
measure the distance from the base of the cartridge to the line.
Verify that it is .180" or less.
Shoot the gun.
Wait for your hand to stop hurting from the recoil.
Order Wolff recoil spring gunsmith pak #14.
Cut some springs with a Dremel tool or grinder to length to fit in the 9mm to increase the force.
Put weights in a bucket and, while holding the slide, and the rope on the trigger guard, measure how much force it take to open the slide and how much to get it all the way back.
The stock springs are 10 pounds.
You can make an assembly that is 48 pounds to the rear for a Glock 19.
This will accelerate the slide too fast for the trigger and the magazine.
Install a New York trigger.
Put two magazine springs in parallel inside the magazine.
Shoot the pistol again.
Your hand doesn't hurt now, does it?
But your fingers hurt from loading the magazine and your wrist is sprained from chambering a round.

[freakshow10mm]

That accomplishes what? Wouldn't a 9x25 Dillon be easier?

[Clark]

I think the 9x25 takes 9.1 gr Power Pistol with that bullet and with more case capacity, would be wimpier.

[WalterGA]

I HOPE this thread was started as a joke! :mad2: And, of course, even though I'm sure Clark's post was intended as jocularity, we all know that slide speed has nothing to do with, nor has any effect on, the type of trigger that one uses in a Glock. I'd hate to think that I'd installed a NY spring in any of my Glocks, for any reason.

[lcarreau]

True CRB at its finest.

[MullahElRon]

I'd hate to think that I'd installed a NY spring in any of my Glocks, for any reason.
Truth, beauty and economy of style.

[918v]

I HOPE this thread was started as a joke! :mad2: And, of course, even though I'm sure Clark's post was intended as jocularity, we all know that slide speed has nothing to do with, nor has any effect on, the type of trigger that one uses in a Glock. I'd hate to think that I'd installed a NY spring in any of my Glocks, for any reason.


Well, yes and no. Just wait until the case cleaning thread.

[918v]

That accomplishes what?

It proves the 9mm case is enormously strong and that Power Pistol is extremely forgiving.

BTW, substituting 6 grains of PP for whatever FC uses under that 115gr. FMJ also reduces the groups by 50%.

[freakshow10mm]

I was referring to Clark's 44 Step Program.

[WalterGA]

I was referring to Clark's 44 Step Program.

Easily distinguishable, I might add, from an Otis Quick-Scoring I.Q. Test!:)

[Steve Koski]

Alternatively, for amusement,

That's why.

[Anvil]

918v Tell the truth. Is the Sig 210 really worth the price? You and Ken Lunde are the only ones I've ever heard get one.

[HiddenEyes]

Now these are the kind of threads I find thought provoking. Doubt I'll ever try any of the things they suggest, but they push the envelope and make the mind think.


Mr. HE:cool:

[Clark]

The 48 pound triple spring assembly will accelerate a Glock 19 slide forward so fast the the magazine spring cannot push up a round fast enough to get pushed into battery. The old case ejects and the chamber comes up empty with ammo still in the magazine. Double magazine springs in parallel will solve this problem, but the mag will hold a least one less round and is a real bitch to load. [I first saw this same problem in April 2000, when I converted a Patriot P45 to shoot 460 Rowland loads]

With the Wolff gunsmith pak #14 and an outer right twist spring made from a .406" coil, .046" wire, cut to 3.9" relaxed and an inner right twist spring made from .260", .027" wire, cut to 2.6" relaxed, make a guide rod with flange on one end and threads on the other end. Sometimes I put a left hand twist spring between the inner and outer spring. Cut a hex nut to be round on the outside so it can fit through the guide rod hole in the slide.

The slide will accelerate forward too fast for the trigger to reset.
There may be another way to get the G19 to reset faster, but I just put a NY trigger in there and it worked.
[The patriot has a striker trigger that does not need to be reset. Before it got the big springs, the recoil would make the striker cover plate fall off]

[lcarreau]

The best way to make ammo more deadly is to fill the cavity of a hollow point with authentic rain forrest monkey dung and seal it with some wax. This may not increase the size or depth of the wound channel, but it will deliver some unpleasant parasites.

-Lonnie

[Steve Koski]

The best way to make ammo more deadly is to fill the cavity of a hollow point with authentic rain forrest monkey dung and seal it with some wax. This may not increase the size or depth of the wound channel, but it will deliver some unpleasant parasites.

-Lonnie
Or if you backed that up with some Lee safety chain, man that would be wicked.

[918v]

918v Tell the truth. Is the Sig 210 really worth the price? You and Ken Lunde are the only ones I've ever heard get one.

Yes. The gun is built with near zero clearances out of superb steel, yet functions 100% with all ammo types. The trigger is extremely consistent, being a two-stage design like that found in their K31 rifles. The bore centerline is low, just like in a Glock, and the perceived recoil and muzzle flip is half that of a comparable S&W. The frame profile is thin, so you can install grips suited for any hand size. I don't think you can do any better for target shooting.

I do not think it is well suited for CCW, though. Trigger reset is very long. The sights are small and thin. Mag changes are slow, unless you get a $5000 P210-8. There are better choices for gunfighting.

[MakeMineaP99]

210s run about $2k-$3??

[918v]

Yes. I paid $2K for mine in 98% condition. I got the Swiss military issue version with an "A" serial number. It is completely free of any makings other than the serial numbers, the "SIG" emblem, a swiss shield with a cross, and two proof marks. My dealer said, "WTF is this???" It doesn't even have a caliber marking on the barrel.

[Clark]

Back to the 9mm mo deadly, I have got the 11 gr Power Pistol 158 gr working for many 9mms, and that is way more powerful than 357 mag, but the 9mms are too heavy to carry and it the load kicks like hell.

So, I am carrying a mousegun P3AT, at 10 ounces loaded.

I have put lots of effort into getting that 380 mo deadly.
I can get beyond the 357 mag level of deadly with a 1903 Browning 380 [8.5 gr Power Pistol 158 gr], the the little P3AT is very hard to get mo deadly. The best I can do is 6.2 gr Power Pistol, 90 gr Gold Dot, chronos at a little more than 1100 fps from the 2.76" barrel.

I carry the P3AT in one shirt pocket and my cell phone in the other.
I now need to wear shirts with two pockets.

[HiddenEyes]

I carry the P3AT in one shirt pocket and my cell phone in the other.
I now need to wear shirts with two pockets.


I started carrying my cell phone in my shirt pocket too. Reason I did was an LE I knew that was in an accident. Her phone was in her jeans pocket and was thrown eighty feet from the car. Since that time I have always buttoned it into a shirt pocket.

This is based on studies that say you are likely to be able to get to a shirt pocket, even with broken limbs in some cases. Also why I carry a folding knife in one shirt pocket now. They have found that LE who carry a folder there are better able to get to it in a fight.

I'm slowly getting rid of all my shirts with one or no pockets.


Mr. HE:cool:

[freakshow10mm]

When driving in snowstorms, I clip my cell phone to the chest strap on my seat belt.

My seat covers have a velcro pouch in the front face of the seat. I keep an escape hammer in there.

[918v]

Back to the 9mm mo deadly, I have got the 11 gr Power Pistol 158 gr working for many 9mms, and that is way more powerful than 357 mag, but the 9mms are too heavy to carry and it the load kicks like hell.

How would this work in a blowback system like an AR15? I realize that a stronger buffer spring would be needed, but how strong? Your load would surely break the 2000 FPS barrier in a 16" barrel.

[Clark]

918V,
you have an AR running blow back?
Mine are all gas operated rotating bolt, with lots of little lugs.

My 9mms are all locked breech too.
My wimpy P3AT 380 is locked breech too, but is only half as powerful as my blow back 1903 Browning 380. The slide mass, chamber thickness, and case support are far more important than locking a breech in that case.

My father and Gene Stoner were contempories. They were sometimes competitors and sometimes co operative in trying to get money for gun designs from Rock Island Arsenal and Detroit Arsenal. My dad is really old now. Sometimes he thinks his guns fought in WWII like himself. I tell him, "No Dad, YOU fought in WWII, your GUNS fought in Viet Nam."

[gwalchmai]

I'm saving all my surplus powder and pulls from rounds I find at the range into my WTF stash. I figure that after Hillabama outlaws reloading I can always fall back on my WTF stash for SHTF reloads.

[sparky241]

When driving in snowstorms, I clip my cell phone to the chest strap on my seat belt.

My seat covers have a velcro pouch in the front face of the seat. I keep an escape hammer in there.
i keep this clipped to the door pouch in my burb http://www.galls.com/style.html?assort=general_catalog&style=KN069

[918v]

918V,
you have an AR running blow back?
Mine are all gas operated rotating bolt, with lots of little lugs.



Colt AR 9mm conversion is blowback. I had one, sold the upper, and now am contemplating building a custom unit with all the fancy rails and such.

[Tree Rat]

210's are nice.....but my X5 will whip it's ass in more ways than one.

Canadian dime sized groups at........



TR

[ISUSteve]

The best way to make ammo more deadly is to fill the cavity of a hollow point with authentic rain forrest monkey dung and seal it with some wax. This may not increase the size or depth of the wound channel, but it will deliver some unpleasant parasites.

-Lonnie


I like a drop of nitroglycerin sealed with wax. Not Monkey Magnum explosion, but cuts back on the collaterial damage.

[ISUSteve]

I've heard of pulling bullets in rifle rounds and turning them around, putting the base forward to make them deadlier.

[Clark]

Colt AR 9mm conversion is blowback. I had one, sold the upper, and now am contemplating building a custom unit with all the fancy rails and such.

I was wondering.
I is not like you to be wrong about anything.
I have never seen a 9mm AR up close.
It is news to me that they are blow backs.



How can I get deadlier?
I may get a Kahr 45 and cut some off the plastic frame and magazine.

I wish they made a tiny Scantium 5 shot 45acp revolver.