Chemical Agents

[918v]

Why doesn't OC Pepper Spray come shaped like a squirt-gun?

[ISUSteve]

Liberals

[creekwalker]

I’d think it was due more to the aerosol container and manufacturing process than anything else. After all even the OC products with a handle and trigger for large scale crowd control or bear’s still have the metal aerosol container don’t they? Anyone who’s ever had an OC container leak or discharge within a patrol vehicle will tell you that they’re more interested in a small, safe, secure package they can readily deploy than something shaped like a handgun. Once you start adding a pistol, OC, TASER, handcuffs, flashlight, baton, radio, magazine pouch etc to a duty belt space for the equipment suddenly becomes a major asset.

cw

[HellsBelle]

I carry a can of this while I'm at work since I can't carry here (I work at a hospital).

Can someone tell me how far this stuff "shoots" and how close I have to be to use it on someone? I've never practiced with it because I know how much "active ingredient" it has in it.

[Anvil]

Why doesn't OC Pepper Spray come shaped like a squirt-gun?

For the children?

[918v]

I carry a can of this while I'm at work since I can't carry here (I work at a hospital).

Can someone tell me how far this stuff "shoots" and how close I have to be to use it on someone? I've never practiced with it because I know how much "active ingredient" it has in it.

About 6 feet depending on the brand/size you have. You should try out a burst just to see how your unit works, or if it works at all.

[Anvil]

The truth is, whatever chemical agent you carry you need to be contaminated with it so when you use it, you don't become incapacitated yourself.


I recall MANY times in law enforcement where someone used a whole damn can on a guy and the criminal was choking but since I've been exposed to it so much and contaminated so many times I was able to fight through it and get the guy in custody.


OC is no good if it wipes YOU out too.

[creekwalker]

HB you also need to keep up with the experation date stamped on your OC and replace it on or before that date. As already mentioned do test your OC from time to time to make sure it retains its pressure. The easiest way to do this is at the range, using one of the down range targets to see were you hit with the OC stream. It dissapates pretty quick in an open area so running everyone off the range isn't a problem. Send me a PM with your OC product information and I'll research it through our training data and let you know if a better products avaliable for you.

cw

[918v]

The truth is, whatever chemical agent you carry you need to be contaminated with it so when you use it, you don't become incapacitated yourself.


I recall MANY times in law enforcement where someone used a whole damn can on a guy and the criminal was choking but since I've been exposed to it so much and contaminated so many times I was able to fight through it and get the guy in custody.


OC is no good if it wipes YOU out too.

And don't spray into the wind :wink5:

[DssG19]

I carry a can of this while I'm at work since I can't carry here (I work at a hospital).

Can someone tell me how far this stuff "shoots" and how close I have to be to use it on someone? I've never practiced with it because I know how much "active ingredient" it has in it.

Never been sprayed? I carry MK3 and it's supposed to be good up to 12 feet. I've hosed three people with the stuff and it had little to no effect. Looks good in the use of force report.

When I got sprayed I was crying like an 5 year old little girl. If you're pumped on on dope and adrenaline I guess you don't feel it.

[creekwalker]

Regrettably, not all OC sprays are created equal with respect to their amount of capsaicin content or effectiveness. Also, even the best of the OC sprays may have a problematic effect on an EDP or individual on crack cocaine or methamphetamines such as crystal meth. I’ve also observed les then perfect results in heavily intoxicated subjects. So if you plan on your OC getting the job done whenever you’re called upon to use it than guess again.
This defines why defensive tactics and training are critical in law enforcement and should be equally so in the private security sector and amongst trained civilians. I always encourage any female subjects I encounter on or off duty that express personal safety concerns to sign up for and attend a R.A.D. course http://www.rad-systems.com/ (http://www.rad-systems.com/), of course other D.T. courses are also available for interested or concerned individuals regardless of gender.
So while I’ve digressed from the overall question/topic of OC, I hope I’ve succeeded in tying it in to the overall context of knowing your equipment as well as the importance of training. Perhaps less lethal approaches correlate more with LE S.O.P.s, but why can’t civilians have other options too.

creekwalker

[Steve Koski]

I carry a can of this while I'm at work since I can't carry here (I work at a hospital).

Can someone tell me how far this stuff "shoots" and how close I have to be to use it on someone? I've never practiced with it because I know how much "active ingredient" it has in it.


Best idea is to buy two. Go shoot one so you learn how it works, then keep the second one ready.

One hint though, don't practice when it is windy.

I wish I didn't learn that one the hard way.

[lcarreau]

I carry spray when I walk the dog because unrestrained dogs is a problem in my area. That stuff sends them on their way pretty quick. :)

[DssG19]

I carry spray when I walk the dog because unrestrained dogs is a problem in my area. That stuff sends them on their way pretty quick. :)

Don't attempt on a charging pit bull ya might get bit. Rem 870 is a better option if ya got one handy. I saw an officer get his leg torn up a bit trying to use that stuff. He whacked it on the head with a baton and got it to retreat a bit. When he came back for more his partner hit him with 00 buck at around 4 feet. It was quite a sight, talk about a one shot drop.

But yeah, for the avarage aggresive dog its awesome.

[degoodman]

I like fire extinguishers for a dog, if you know you're headed at a dog that is.

[Glooooock]

+ 100 on the wind spraying

It seems the police version is tabasco XX. The civilian stuff is taco bell mild red sauce . A deputy once told me he sprayed a 400 lb Samoan with a few cans , wiped his face and said so thats how its gona be dep .

[cvfl]

About 6 feet depending on the brand/size you have. You should try out a burst just to see how your unit works, or if it works at all.

Always good advice.

Wait, we are still talking about pepper spray right? :skep:

[45auto]

Try it out.

I bought my wife a asp key defender and the inert practice inserts... I tried it out... tried hard to get her to practice with it...

I have been hit with tear gas before... that stuff is fun... :p

[JW6108]

One of our instructors said the best way he could describe it would be to imagine going in MacDonalds and bobbing for french fries. We were not required to be sprayed in order to carry it, but some agencies do require that. I didn't see the logic of that, since I carried a baton and didn't have to be swatted with it in order to do so. OC has its place in the force continuum; it's just another tool in the bag.

The residue from OC lasts a while and can show up in uncomfortable places. One of our guys volunteered to be sprayed when he was in mandate training. The instructors tell you to shut your eyes tightly and lock your lips back into your mouth. You get about one little pfft. Anyway, this guy gets decontaminated (he thought), ain't so bad yada, yada. That night in the dorm he got in the shower. There was residue in his hair he didn't realize he had: the water washed it down his back into the valley,
ultimately winding up on his satchel. I don't recall how many laps he said he made around the shower stall, but it was hilarious to hear him tell it.

The stream or foam type is better if you are outside; neither of these are as likely to blow back on you. We were told if we ever used ours even for a short burst that we should get a brand new canister; there is some perception that the propellant might slowly leak out afterward and leave you with a can that won't spray.

I used some on a dog last September while I was out walking. He decided to go do something else other than bother me.

[jawjaboy]

:supergrin:
.

[MakeMineaP99]

I never understood the point of carrying pepper spray. Seems to be more trouble than it's worth splashing back on you and put the hurt on you. Granted, unlike they cops in here, I don't have to tangle with drug crazed folks for a living. However, I would think with the advent of tasers, that pepper spray would be a thing of the past.

[Steve Koski]

Taser - Expensive
Pepper Spray - Cheap

[Glooooock]

Its that whole less than lethal mind set . My personal choice " liquid anhydrous ammonia " used for commercial refrigeration / fertilizer / . This is so nasty 2oz will clear a 2500 sq ft house in seconds.

[CZ93X62]

Now, G-Lock........how politically incorrect of you.

I'll bet the LAA would kick azz as a copper remover in rifle barrels. The neighbors would be loving it lots, too.

[Glooooock]

We had a funny story from a retiring swat guy we know . Apparently there is a gas chart for the number of rounds to lob into a house ( sq ft VS rounds / canisters ).

Back in the 80s he was on the lawn of this house whispering back to another member ,,,, on a call out " Hey , you have a chart " Nooooooooo .

Aaaah fire 4-5 into the windows . They get the guy out , and gas about 3 block of residential streets .
Latter it was determined he used enough gas 3000 Sqft on a 1000 sqft house .The real fun was when the CHP found the gas drifting on to the freeway on ramp . :driving: Good times

[45auto]

We had a funny story from a retiring swat guy we know . Apparently there is a gas chart for the number of rounds to lob into a house ( sq ft VS rounds / canisters ).

Back in the 80s he was on the lawn of this house whispering back to another member ,,,, on a call out " Hey , you have a chart " Nooooooooo .

Aaaah fire 4-5 into the windows . They get the guy out , and gas about 3 block of residential streets .
Latter it was determined he used enough gas 3000 Sqft on a 1000 sqft house .The real fun was when the CHP found the gas drifting on to the freeway on ramp . :driving: Good times

:animlol:

[chewy]

Chemical Agents was a band I played in during the 80s'. I don't remember much.