Up grading your smelting set up

[Anvil]

Is there a way upgrade a smelting set up so that it is more heat efficent?

I've got a big dutch oven 14 quart with lid and a crab cooker but I'm going through alot of propane. Is there anything out there I can insulate my dutch oven with that won't get burnt off when cooking? Can a dutch oven be made into a bottom pour?

[Pitmaster]

Is there a way upgrade a smelting set up so that it is more heat efficent?

I've got a big dutch oven 14 quart with lid and a crab cooker but I'm going through alot of propane. Is there anything out there I can insulate my dutch oven with that won't get burnt off when cooking? Can a dutch oven be made into a bottom pour?

You might be able to put 55 gallon drum over everything. Cut some holes for plenty of air near the ground and through the lid. That will help hold heat in. Don't smelt when the weather is below 0º.

I don't know about the bottom pouring. I've never tried to cut or drill a hole in cast iron.

[cohutt]

Cooking the lead with that nukular burner is like powering 3 houses with a 1000 megawatt power plant. Even while "idling" it's going to suck that propane out big.

[AlPackin]

I have had experience in designing control systems for annealing furnaces. Metal can only absorb heat at a given rate. If you apply more btu's per hour than the metal can absorb the energy just goes up the stack wasted. Bigger isn't always better.

[cohutt]

I have had experience in designing control systems for annealing furnaces. Metal can only absorb heat at a given rate. If you apply more btu's per hour than the metal can absorb the energy just goes up the stack wasted. Bigger isn't always better.

Isn't that what I said?

:confused:

[Anvil]

Cooking the lead with that nukular burner is like powering 3 houses with a 1000 megawatt power plant. Even while "idling" it's going to suck that propane out big.

Yeah, but the propane tank freeze up quickly and before I can really get going my tanks are frozen. Plus it takes a while to get to full melt since I have zero insulation.

I'm thinking about buying a dedicated lead melting set up, industrial style.

I'm spending plenty on propane (ALOT OF WASTED GAS) and I'd just as soon hook up to the house natural gas and cut my cost.

The problem is all the companies I've looked at want $3-8,000 for their smelting furnaces. I really don't have that kind of jack lying around.

Maybe I could justify it if I had 16 tons of lead to melt but you know what they say...


You load 16 tons... what do ya get? Another day older and deeper in debt.

[AlPackin]

Isn't that what I said?

:confused:
yeah, just seconding the vote :)

[cohutt]

found a good "idea site" for you:

http://www.submarineboat.com/sub/lead.html

teaser pic:

http://www.submarineboat.com/sub/images/lead_frunance.JPG

[cohutt]

Finally found the site i was looking for

a bottom pour rig with parts picture


http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=707

[AdamN]

Is there a way upgrade a smelting set up so that it is more heat efficent?

I've got a big dutch oven 14 quart with lid and a crab cooker but I'm going through alot of propane. Is there anything out there I can insulate my dutch oven with that won't get burnt off when cooking? Can a dutch oven be made into a bottom pour?

How much lead you got Anvil?? Heck I can do probably 1000+ of WW on a single 20lb bottle.

[craig110]

Is there a way upgrade a smelting set up so that it is more heat efficent?

I've got a big dutch oven 14 quart with lid and a crab cooker but I'm going through alot of propane. Is there anything out there I can insulate my dutch oven with that won't get burnt off when cooking? Can a dutch oven be made into a bottom pour?

(Knowing I'll catch flack for this...) Unless you need/want to be finicky on the specific alloy you are using, the best way of being heat efficient is to get rid of the separate smelting operation. Toss the WWs, bermine, etc., into the casting pot, skim, flux well, skim, and cast. You melt the lead just once that way which is more efficient than melting it twice.

[AdamN]

Yea that is narrowing your focus a bit to much. You need an effecient way to get clean alloy, after that determine what you need and mix as necessary. You can use the smelter for that operation or just mix in the casting pot.

Cooking off the crud just gets to much crap in the casting pot. If bottom pour its a little tougher getting everything out around the spout.
I know.......... I did everything in one pot for a while, (Years ago) effecient, yes but not the "best" way to go.

[Boge]

(Knowing I'll catch flack for this...) Unless you need/want to be finicky on the specific alloy you are using, the best way of being heat efficient is to get rid of the separate smelting operation. Toss the WWs, bermine, etc., into the casting pot, skim, flux well, skim, and cast. You melt the lead just once that way which is more efficient than melting it twice.

That's EXACTLY how I do it. :iagree::sifone:

[jawjaboy]

Yea that is narrowing your focus a bit to much. You need an effecient way to get clean alloy, after that determine what you need and mix as necessary. You can use the smelter for that operation or just mix in the casting pot.

Cooking off the crud just gets to much crap in the casting pot. If bottom pour its a little tougher getting everything out around the spout.
I know.......... I did everything in one pot for a while, (Years ago) effecient, yes but not the "best" way to go.

Yessir. :iagree:

[Anvil]

The problem I'm getting is I'm not getting 1000 pounds per 20 pound bottle. I'm getting ALOT less. Closer to 150. The monster burner I got that put out 330,000 BTU is emptying the bottle quickly but its also causing the bottle to freeze.

What I believe I'm going to do is just buy me a dedicated lead melting set up... something like a Johnson 313 with temp control. Just shovel in the ww and 30 min later skim. Run it off the house natural gas and do a few hundred pounds per melt in a few hours rather than the 150 pounds in 2 hours.

It's gonna cost me about 3k but if my ww pickup route justifies that kind of melter then I won't have a problem getting one. I'm gonna see how much lead I can horde and scrounge over the summer to see if it's gonna be worth it.

http://www.johnsongas.com/images/313.jpg

[craig110]

Yea that is narrowing your focus a bit to much. You need an effecient way to get clean alloy, after that determine what you need and mix as necessary. You can use the smelter for that operation or just mix in the casting pot.

Cooking off the crud just gets to much crap in the casting pot. If bottom pour its a little tougher getting everything out around the spout.
I know.......... I did everything in one pot for a while, (Years ago) effecient, yes but not the "best" way to go.

Well, if I find I'm dealing with too much crud then I'll step up to a dual-pot setup. (Though by then, I'll hopefully be buying ingots. Once I'm flat-out busy doing law, bermining becomes financially very inefficient since one hour of law fees buys a lot of ingots.) Perhaps one aspect that has kept the crud from building up is that melting down bermine lead is a pretty clean operation. Lots of dirt and cases to skim off, and besides those not burning there is nothing like chunks of plastic to make the melt nasty.

[AdamN]

Anvil here is my smelter, bargain turkey fryer, yard sale dutch oven (with lid).

I have a metal ring around the pot as a wind shield.

The first batch takes the longest, half hour to 45 minutes. I dont empty the pot for each batch, I leave a few inches in the bottom and add more WW. When full repeat. Probably 20 minutes between batches once it gets going.

I leave the lid on the majority of the time, I have a hole drilled in the lid to insert a thermometer if necessary

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/Lead/Smelt2.jpg

[Anvil]

Anvil here is my smelter, bargain turkey fryer, yard sale dutch oven (with lid).

I have a metal ring around the pot as a wind shield.

The first batch takes the longest, half hour to 45 minutes. I dont empty the pot for each batch, I leave a few inches in the bottom and add more WW. When full repeat. Probably 20 minutes between batches once it gets going.

I leave the lid on the majority of the time, I have a hole drilled in the lid to insert a thermometer if necessary

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/Lead/Smelt2.jpg


I'm gonna drill that thermometer hole in mine too. That's a good idea!

I like that round housing you've got that turkey frier in. Id love to wrap that dutch oven in some fireproof insulation and go to town!

Craig, really. Buying ingots? Hell, you might as well just buy your bullets and if so you're only a step away from buying your ammo.

[craig110]

Craig, really. Buying ingots? Hell, you might as well just buy your bullets and if so you're only a step away from buying your ammo.

I hope not! I enjoy casting and reloading way too much to do that. Bermining is a good source of free lead, and thus is a fine CRB economics choice, but to me it isn't anywhere near as high up on the fun scale as is the hobby of casting and reloading. I do have one auto shop saving WWs for me, but they don't do a big tire business so I doubt they'll keep me in lead. I'm guessing that by fall I'll have a deal with one of you GPers to send me an FRB of ingots every month or two for a while to build up my stash. Frankly, a penny or two per bullet for the lead won't kill me if it keeps the rest of my hobby going strong.

[cohutt]

Bermining is a good source of free lead, and thus is a fine CRB economics choice, but to me it isn't anywhere near as high up on the fun scale as is the hobby of casting and reloading.

We have the understatement of the year right there....