1st test of .45 lead failure...

[soundwave]

Went to the range today to test out a few rounds of lead I loaded up for my G21 with Lonewolf barrel.

They are: Presision Bullets (dry lube coasted) 200 gr. LRNFP / 5 grains 231 / OAL 1.225.

I took down the OAL to around 1.225 just to get them to seat in the chamber. At 1.225 they seemed fine when I dropped them into the chamber, they stuck a little, but it wasn't excessive.

Today at the range, they were not giving me any love. I started by loading one into the mag, shooting it, then checking the spent case for pressure signs. They first 3 chambered and fired one at a time.

Then I loaded 5 intot he mag to check cycling. No good. From that point on, none of the rounds fully chambered. And the slide took some elbow grease to manually eject the unfired rounds.

So, what do yall think? My first instinct is to take the OLA down a bit more.

Thanks!

[freakshow10mm]

Drop it to 1.185". That's what I run my G30 at. XTPs get 1.225" but lead TCs are 1.185".

[AdamN]

The LW barrels are known for being to tight. Im not talking accuracy tight, Im talking malfunction tight.

You can load up a dummy round and color the end of the brass and some of the bullet with a magic marker, chamber it and extract it, then you can see where the contact is in the chamber by where the marking has rubbed off.

Ive had my hands on several of the "aftermarket" barrels that were not chambered deep enough. A Clymer chamber "GO" gauge would not even fit.

Now your barrel may be fine and something may need to be adjusted on your reloads. If you have the factory barrel for your gun you can compare the fit of the reloads comparing the two.

[soundwave]

Drop it to 1.185". That's what I run my G30 at. XTPs get 1.225" but lead TCs are 1.185".

Thanks Freak, I was hoping someone would testify for a shorter OAL. That is what I am going to try for next time. :thumbsup:

EDIT: Hey Freak, when you reference 1.185", is that in a G30 OEm barrel or after market? Thanks!

[soundwave]

The LW barrels are known for being to tight. Im not talking accuracy tight, Im talking malfunction tight.

You can load up a dummy round and color the end of the brass and some of the bullet with a magic marker, chamber it and extract it, then you can see where the contact is in the chamber by where the marking has rubbed off.

Ive had my hands on several of the "aftermarket" barrels that were not chambered deep enough. A Clymer chamber "GO" gauge would not even fit.

Now your barrel may be fine and something may need to be adjusted on your reloads. If you have the factory barrel for your gun you can compare the fit of the reloads comparing the two.

Yes, the LW chamber is definitely tighter than my Glock chamber. Just dropping in the rounds confirms this.

The 1.225 rounds dropped in the LW barrel but didn't seat 100%, they still had 1 mm or 2 to go. I thought the the slide would work them into full battery. I was wrong :(

Thank you for he info and ideas. :seeya:

[freakshow10mm]

KKM Precision barrel.

[918v]

Seat them to 1.200" OAL and do over.

[Steve Koski]

Can anyone recommend a gunsmith to open up LWD and similar tight barrels, to allow lead bullets to chamber reliably?

[freakshow10mm]

Check with Bob Hunter of Hunter Customs (.com). He reamed the chamber on my Para and Kimber barrels to 10mm. I trust him with barrel work. 1911s are his specialty, but I personally wouldn't hesitate to have him do barrel/chamber work for me. Very nice, humble guy.

Call him up and talk to him about it.

[soundwave]

Can anyone recommend a gunsmith to open up LWD and similar tight barrels, to allow lead bullets to chamber reliably?

I was thinking about contacting Lonewolf and asking them to do it. Seems like they would need to look into it as they advertise the barrel for lead and FMJ.

[Steve Koski]

Good idea. I would sure like my chamber and throat a bit more generous.

[soundwave]

Good idea. I would sure like my chamber and throat a bit more generous.

Me too! I'm gonna e-mail them firth thing tomorrow. I will report back what I find.

[918v]

Maybe you should size down the bullet? Lee makes a cheap die for this. Bump them down to .451"

[AdamN]

Can anyone recommend a gunsmith to open up LWD and similar tight barrels, to allow lead bullets to chamber reliably?


Well I have everything to do 45acp. Reamer, throater, guages, know how:sifone:

Never got around to getting the stuff for 40 and 9 yet but I have been planning to.

If you dont get any satisfaction from LW just pm me and Ill fix your barrel.

Adam

[soundwave]

Me too! I'm gonna e-mail them firth thing tomorrow. I will report back what I find.

Ok, so I got an e-mail back from LW. This was the response:

Clean the barrel and take it back out to the range. Run a magazine of factory ammunition through it. If the barrels runs the factory ammo without a hiccup the problem is with your reloads. I am guessing you are not full length resizing your brass. All you have to do is run the brass through a small base sizer die and it will squeeze down to factory specifications.
If you remove the barrel from the gun and drop each round into the chamber you will be able to find the ones that need resizing. If the round is not flush with the barrel hood it needs to be resized.


Doesn't really help out too much as my problem concerns lead ammo (wider than factory FMJ). Oh well, I will just size the OAL down and go from there.

[AdamN]

If you get sick of messin with it send me that barrel and Ill fix it for ya. Just pay the return shipping:yesnod:

[soundwave]

If you get sick of messin with it send me that barrel and Ill fix it for ya. Just pay the return shipping:yesnod:

Thank you! That is one hellava offer. I am going to try it out this weekend one more time and if it is still fussy I will take you up on it. :seeya:

[AdamN]

Between here and other forums there have been several folks that had problems with aftermarket chambers. Yammer had a 40 barreel that he ended up making a cerrosafe cast to verify it was undersized. I believe they eventually took care of it for him.

I just happen to have the 45 stuff for my own use, Ill work on a 1911 from time to time. A lot of the better barrels are short chambered and need a little finish work on the chamber when fitted.

[MakeMineaP99]

Between here and other forums there have been several folks that had problems with aftermarket chambers. Yammer had a 40 barreel that he ended up making a cerrosafe cast to verify it was undersized. I believe they eventually took care of it for him.

I just happen to have the 45 stuff for my own use, Ill work on a 1911 from time to time. A lot of the better barrels are short chambered and need a little finish work on the chamber when fitted.

Sorry, if you make a cast of the chamber and it ain't to spec, they damn well better take care of you. No ifs, ands or buts. If they don't, I'll make a hobby out of them for three weeks, that should take care of them. :supergrin:

I've always said if I ever get an aftermarket barrel for the G17, it will be Bar-Sto. Sure the price is high, but the quality is there.

"Good things cost money."--Oscar Schindler

Have you ever examined a SIG factory barrel? I have some suspicions.

Did you pick up a South Bend yet?

[AdamN]

Most guys either dont have or dont want to mess with getting cerrosafe or making a chamber cast. As soon as those places hear "reloads" they say "well theres your problem" " you need to shoot factory jacketed bullets":incazzato:

WTF is the point RIGHT:dita:


Sig factory barrel??? cant say that I have other than shooting a Sig occasionally that a buddy had.


South Bend, no not yet, not looking seriously yet. Still tooling the Bridgeport a bit.

Did the CRB thing on a Troyke 12" rotary table over the weekend, Almost $2K new, I found a used one, talked him down to $325.00:sifone:

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/Troyke.jpg

[MakeMineaP99]

Certain SIGs, seem to have problems with .452 lead bullets, my 245 included. If I size them to .451 to feed, I get leading in leade, even with different lube type, alloy, and other variables being controlled. This is the one that had problems feeding those TCs you send me, the 220 did better. If I can't figure this out soon, the 245 is history. I'll be damned if I'm going to own a .45 that needs jacketed.

Oddly enough, my 220 is fine.

I know 'Slick has a 226 that leads like there's no tomorrow, no matter what he does. I think it's a SIG thing. SIGs require more attention than women.

Is there a such thing as a handgun barrel blank? Turn it down to proper OD, and machine in the looking lugs? You'd be assured of the quality, that's for sure.

[AdamN]

Could need the throat cut a little deeper and at a better angle. Have you made a cast of the chamber?? Would you like it done??

I have the throating reamer if it needs it.

[AdamN]

Oh and yes you can get barrel blanks, Ive seen assorted sizes, different twist etc. Something like the Barsto and some other "premium" barrels are hard to beat.

For 1911's the Karts and a couple others are usually 100%

[MakeMineaP99]

Could need the throat cut a little deeper and at a better angle. Have you made a cast of the chamber?? Would you like it done??

I have the throating reamer if it needs it.

No, that is something I don't have the head knowledge to do (yet), I've only slugged the bore, which slugged at .451.

Thanks for the offer. Could you tell me how to do it? What do I need? What am I looking for? I'm sure you could do it in your sleep, but I would like to learn.

If it's something best left for Adam Neat, gunsmith extraordinaire, I assume you just need the barrel.

I'll leave the reaming to you. :wink5:

"Give a man a fish, he eats for a day, teach a man to fish, he eats for life."

[AdamN]

Here are a few images for you, a good cerrosafe cast of the chamber would help reveal any issues, it will basicly allow you a better look at the inside of the chamber.

A few measurements comparing to the dimensions given can reveal any problems.

For a problem like Soundwave is having its as simple as dropping in the "GO" chamber guage, my guess from his description is that the guage will come up short indicating the chamber was probably cut with a reamer that needed sharpening or replacing.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/Chamber3.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/Chamber2.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h165/aneat/45chamber-1.jpg

[918v]

Those are excellent, ANeat.

I have found two types of chambers in the 45's in my life. Some have a straight freebore while others have a tapered freebore. Those with a straight freebore need undresized bullets to chamber reliably. Those with tapered freebores feed anything. I suspect the LW barrel has a straight freebore and needs .451" bullets. My CQB was like that, but it did not lead. My Springer has a tapered freebore and feeds .4525" bullets just fine.

Still, it may be that the freebore is not the culprit, but the OAL. The bullet is simply hitting the rifling. I bet it won't at 1.200" OAL.

Another issue may be the bullet coating. I don't use these bullets, but have seen a .001" diameter variance within the same box.

[soundwave]

Those are excellent, ANeat.

I have found two types of chambers in the 45's in my life. Some have a straight freebore while others have a tapered freebore. Those with a straight freebore need undresized bullets to chamber reliably. Those with tapered freebores feed anything. I suspect the LW barrel has a straight freebore and needs .451" bullets. My CQB was like that, but it did not lead. My Springer has a tapered freebore and feeds .4525" bullets just fine.

Still, it may be that the freebore is not the culprit, but the OAL. The bullet is simply hitting the rifling. I bet it won't at 1.200" OAL.

Another issue may be the bullet coating. I don't use these bullets, but have seen a .001" diameter variance within the same box.

That sounds pretty dead on. I have been experimenting with some short OAL rounds in the LW barrel and OEM barrel. Long OAL's of 1.250" fit right in my OEM barrel, but don't even come close in the LW barrel. I have to take em down to right under 1.200" to get them to fully chamber in the LW barrel. It is def a tight freebore. These bullets measure at .4515-.452 so they are a tad wider that FMJ. But in the future shooting lead I am gonna have an ever harder time I bet.

Aneat, I will probably be asking for your addy to ship next week after I test out these 1.200" rounds this weekend.

Thank you again for your help :seeya:

[AdamN]

I never did care for a chamber that tight in a handgun. It does nothing to help the accuracy and just makes the gun so darn finicky. A little extra room will make the gun 100% reliable when clean and even after 1000 rounds without cleaning. A little powder fouling or carbon buildup and you start having problems chambering or ejecting brass.

Both my bullseye 45's chamber my .4525 bullets just fine and are very accurate. Its all in the slide fit and lockup.

[dbotos]

+1 on ANeat's work. I had him ream a .45 chamber for me one time and it cured the problems I was having. Thanks again, man.

I need to get myself a nice Bridgeport like you've got there... :supergrin: